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Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee - AMC Conquest Guide (WIP)

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Smite God: Ah Muzen Cab

Build Guide Discussion (26) More Guides

Purchase Order

Build 1 - Starter Items Notes This start provides lots of power and sustain as the MP5 from both Mage's Blessing and Morningstar will be more than enough for you stay in lane longer for extra farm; this is essential in buying Transcendence early so you can start stacking it as soon as possible.

Build Item Mage's Blessing Mage's Blessing
Build Item Morningstar Morningstar
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion

Build 1 (see notes for boots replacement) Notes This build was sourced from Kriega1, who made it in the comment section of 'S5 AMC Build' by DiabolicNutria. I've tried and tested it with great success, credit to Kriega1!

When you've finished the build sell Warrior Tabi for Titan's Bane then buy the Elixir of Speed.

Build Item Warrior Tabi Warrior Tabi
Build Item Transcendence Transcendence
Build Item The Crusher The Crusher
Build Item The Executioner The Executioner
Build Item Qin's Sais Qin's Sais
Build Item Bloodforge Bloodforge

Build 2 - Starter Items Notes This start gives you the most AS out of any start which offers an alternative way in playing Ah Muzen Cab early as Short Bow provides no power, forcing you to rely on your AA's for your main damage source. When paired with Hive at level 2, your AS will most likely be higher than the enemy ADC, vastly helping your poke damage.

Build Item Mage's Blessing Mage's Blessing
Build Item Short Bow Short Bow
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion

Build 2 (see notes for boots replacement) Notes I know this build seems very strange, especially considering Silverbranch Bow but bear with me please. I'll explain later in the Items section of the guide on how this certain build works and how to use it.

When you've finished the build sell Warrior Tabi
for Bloodforge then buy the Elixir of Speed.

Build Item Warrior Tabi Warrior Tabi
Build Item Ichaival Ichaival
Build Item The Executioner The Executioner
Build Item Qin's Sais Qin's Sais
Build Item Silverbranch Bow Silverbranch Bow
Build Item Odysseus' Bow Odysseus' Bow

Build 3 - Starter Items Notes This start gives you a decent amount of power and lifesteal which lends well to the squishy nature of Ah Muzen Cab as you can sustain yourself longer in lane, thus making it easier to get this expensive build online faster as you can farm longer.

Build Item Mage's Blessing Mage's Blessing
Build Item Spiked Gauntlet Spiked Gauntlet
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion

Build 3 (see notes for boots replacement) Notes This build was sourced from Branmuffin17, who made it in the comment section of this guide. This is definitely an interesting build for Ah Muzen Cab, allowing you to utilise crit for a hybrid ADC, credit to Branmuffin17!

When you've finished the build sell Warrior Tabi for Poisoned Star then buy the Elixir of Speed.

Build Item Warrior Tabi Warrior Tabi
Build Item Devourer's Gauntlet Devourer's Gauntlet
Build Item The Executioner The Executioner
Build Item Qin's Sais Qin's Sais
Build Item Wind Demon Wind Demon
Build Item Deathbringer Deathbringer

Build 4 - Starter Items Notes This start provides a good balance of power and surviveabilty which helps resolve Ah Muzen Cab squishy nature early on, as the health from Cudgel gives him a little wiggle room to absorb another ability or a few AA's.

Build Item Mage's Blessing Mage's Blessing
Build Item Cudgel Cudgel
Build Item Healing Potion Healing Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion
Build Item Mana Potion Mana Potion

Build 4 (see notes for gladiator's shield/boots replacement) Notes This build has recently seen a lot of popularity recently and has coined the term: 'Ah-Bruisen-Cab'. As suggested by the name, this a bruiser build for Ah Muzen Cab that actually works surprisingly well. I'll explain later in the Items section of the guide on how this certain build works and how to use it.

When you've finished the build sell Gladiator's Shield for Odysseus' Bow and sell Warrior Tabi for Titan's Bane then buy the Elixir of Speed.

Build Item Warrior Tabi Warrior Tabi
Build Item Blackthorn Hammer Blackthorn Hammer
Build Item Gladiator's Shield Gladiator's Shield
Build Item Soul Eater Soul Eater
Build Item The Executioner The Executioner
Build Item Qin's Sais Qin's Sais

Situationals Notes Magi's Cloak provides a small amount of protections and surviveability with its passive. Buy this if the enemy team has lots of CC.

Brawler's Beat Stick is a fantastic anti heal item that can apply to lots of enemies at one time. Buy this if the enemy team has healing.

Titan's Bane is the best choice for anti tank due to its passive. Buy this if the enemy team has more than one tank.

Devourer's Gauntlet provides good amounts of lifesteal and physical power. Buy this if in need of a high power lifesteal item.

Toxic Blade is the go to anti heal item for AA gods as the AS/MS/Pen/Passive synergises perfectly with this type of playstyle. Buy this if the enemy team has healing.

Asi has the best of both worlds when it comes to lifesteal, combining both power and AS. Buy this if in need of a high AS lifesteal item.

Ichaival is the best choice for anti AS due to it's passive, not to mention its high AS/power. Buy this if the enemy team has more than one AA god.

Build Item Magi's Cloak Magi's Cloak
Build Item Brawler's Beat Stick Brawler's Beat Stick
Build Item Titan's Bane Titan's Bane
Build Item Devourer's Gauntlet Devourer's Gauntlet
Build Item Toxic Blade Toxic Blade
Build Item Asi Asi
Build Item Ichaival Ichaival

Relics Notes Purification Beads is a must as Ah Muzen Cab has no escape, therefore they'll help you out of stuns, slows etc and let you loose the enemy.

Aegis Amulet helps when having trouble with boxers like Mercury, after activation throw up a Hive for the MS and run way.

Heavenly Wings can be a life saver as the MS helps Ah Muzen Cab out of tricky situations. Also you can use this aggressively when its upgraded, as your AA will grant you haste.

Phantom Veil is essential when facing Odin as it helps you escape his Ring of Spears; this is necessary as you're very squishy and most likely won't survive if you stay inside the Ring of Spears.

Build Item Purification Beads Purification Beads
Build Item Aegis Amulet Aegis Amulet
Build Item Heavenly Wings Heavenly Wings
Build Item Phantom Veil Phantom Veil

Ah Muzen Cab's Skill Order

Hive

Hive

1 X
2 8 11 12 14
Swarm

Swarm

2 A
1 4 6 7 10
Honey

Honey

3 B
3 15 16 18 19
Stinger

Stinger

4 Y
5 9 13 17 20

Introduction/Contents

Hello fellow smite players, this is a guide for Ah Muzen Cab. I'm in no way a smite veteran or a veteran at playing Ah Muzen Cab. However I saw he is quite outdated and needed some love. Therefore I took it upon myself to create a guide for him and for players to understand his role/playstyle/builds etc.

I would like to thank Nanoyam for making this comprehensive God builder guide .... https://www.smitefire.com/smite/guide/a-guide-to-creating-a-guide-11941 ....
and also any future feedback I receive, from other smitefire users, to help make this guide the best it can be.

Below are the other sections to this guide.


Now lets dive into the hive mind of Ah Muzen Cab!

Items

Build 1





This section will go through the purchase order of Build 1 and I'll explain briefly what the items do and how they fit into the build.

This item list will go in the order of the purchase order shown at the beginning of the guide.

Items


Build 2




This section will go through the purchase order of Build 2 and I'll explain briefly what the items do and how they fit into the build.

This item list will go in the order of the purchase order shown at the beginning of the guide.

IMPORTANT NOTE: it is STRONGLY recommended you play under the influence of Hive, as the added 40% attack speed benefits the passive of Silverbranch Bow massively, making the build the most powerful it can be so your AA's hit hard.

Items


Build 3




This section will go through the purchase order of Build 3 and I'll explain briefly what the items do and how they fit into the build.

This item list will go in the order of the purchase order shown at the beginning of the guide.

Items


Build 4




This section will go through the purchase order of Build 4 and I'll explain briefly what the items do and how they fit into the build.

This item list will go in the order of the purchase order shown at the beginning of the guide.

Items

Skills





skills

Pros & Cons

Pros:
  • Decent burst damage
  • Good harassment and poke with his Hive and Honey combo
  • Very good waveclear
  • Has excellent tick damage with the Bees! and The Crusher combo
  • Great mobility under the influence of Hive
  • Solid ultimate that can be used every 18 seconds with its CDR feature
  • Honey provides decent teamfight potential and gank setup
    .
    .
Cons:
  • Very squishy
  • Quite mana hungry
  • Very limited sustain with Hive
  • No escape
  • Vulnerable to all types of CC
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Damage Output

This section will go through the damage output of Ah Muzen Cab, which will include stats from all four of the builds featured in this guide.

Factors of testing:
  • The damage of said ability or AA
  • All the items of said build with max stacks (when relevant)
  • Being level 20
  • All procs of Bees! and The Crusher
  • All testing was done on Odin bots in jungle practice with 5 AA's fired on them prior to testing
Key:
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Build 1
AA: 364
Swarm: 608
Honey: 225
Stinger: 932
.

Build 2 With Hive
AA: 475
Swarm: 433
Honey: 146
Stinger: 720
.
Build 2 Without Hive
AA: 454
Swarm: 422
Honey: 0
Stinger: 705
.
Build 3
AA: 255
AA(crit): 523
Swarm: 369
Honey: 124
Stinger: 627

Build 4
AA: 377
Swarm: 371
Honey: 124
Stinger: 637


Gameplay

This section will go through the Early Game, Mid Game and Late Game for Ah Muzen Cab as well as a few tips to help you gain advantages in your game. You don't have to follow this section word for word, but its a general guideline for how you should be playing Ah Muzen Cab.

Early Game


Mid Game


Late Game

Credits

Thank you for reading through my Ah Muzen Cab guide, I hope this helps in any way as mentioned earlier I'm in no way a smite veteran or a veteran at playing Ah Muzen Cab, so take everything with a pinch of salt, this is my first guide after all!

I'll update this as frequently as I can, when relevant information arrives.

Credit to Kreiga1 for Build 1; Branmuffin17 for Build 3 and Nanoyam for making this comprehensive God builder guide .... https://www.smitefire.com/smite/guide/a-guide-to-creating-a-guide-11941 .... without it my guide would've looked like ***.

Thank you for reading - UPLAR

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Kriega1 (77) | July 17, 2019 6:39am
I think Build 2, 3 and 4 need some tweaks.

Build 2: Too much attack speed, and also I don't think silverbranch has any place here, even crusher would be preferred over it. This build doesen't even have lifesteal either despite being full aa-based. Ichaival is fine since next patch it's getting a bit cheaper. Re-done build: Warrior Tabi, Ichaival, Asi, The Executioner, Qin's Sais, Titan's Bane/ Odysseus' Bow. Sell boots for one you didn't get last. Also change the start to Hunter's Blessing, tier 1 shoes, 3 health pots and 1 mana pot, since it will at least let you rush boots. Short Blade is such a poor choice for a start. Obviously with this start you need to play a bit more passively early due to the lack of power/mp5 from tier 1 trans.

Build 3: Getting exe a bit earlier than needed, and you only have 2 crit items, yet not one of them is Rage. Re-done build: Devourer's Gauntlet, Warrior Tabi, Rage, The Executioner, Deathbringer, Titan's Bane or Wind Demon. Sell boots for Asi. Alternatively if you want a trans crit build: Warrior Tabi, Transcendence, Asi, The Executioner, Rage, Deathbringer, sell boots for Titan's Bane or Bloodforge or Ichaival.

Build 4: Seems really weak damage-wise early to mid game, and I don't see the point of qins with such low attack speed. Re-done build: Warrior Tabi (talaria got nerfed), Blackthorn Hammer, The Crusher/ Brawler's Beat Stick, The Executioner, Odysseus' Bow, Titan's Bane. Sell boots for Asi.

Build 1 is still fine but I think Qin's Sais should be traded for Odysseus' Bow. Titan's Bane can be traded for Bloodforge if necessary, boots can be replaced late for Qin's Sais, Asi, or Bloodforge. Crusher can be swapped for Brawler's Beat Stick for antiheal if needed. Also change the mana pots for the start to multi pots.
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UPLAR (6) | July 18, 2019 2:47am
Build 2: Silverbranch Bow is an item for hunters with AS steroids, as Hive is a permanent AS steroid of 40%,(as long as you stay within its radius), this item is very welcome. Also this build does have lifesteal as Bloodforge is the boots replacement.

Build 3: I can put The Executioner as 4th/5th if you want. This build however does have 3 crit items: Wind Demon // Deathbringer // Poisoned Star as boots replacement. Check mine and Bran's discussion about crit builds in the comments for clarification.

Build 4: I agree with your points, just wondering where Gladiator's Shield would go, unless you think it's shouldn't be built.

Build 1: I agree, but I'm keeping the Mana Potion as Multi Potion are too restrictive and there's many situations where I've used them ONLY for mana or ONLY for health as there was no other choice, which I feel is a waste of gold. Not to mention Hive provides infinite healing, just place one directly behind your tower, slow but viable so Mana Potion are fine here.
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Kriega1 (77) | July 18, 2019 3:09am
Poisoned Star is a pretty poor choice for a crit item right now.
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Kriega1 (77) | July 18, 2019 3:07am
Selling boots to get your lifesteal in a pure-aa Build is just too late, and also silverbranch is just not that good of an item.
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UPLAR (6) | May 23, 2019 3:44pm
Perhaps, I've used it a couple times to decent success against AA god's like Arachne. I'm currently deciding which God will be my next guide atm, so once I finish that, I'll update this too. (Also I'll incorporate some Asi/ Ichaival builds too when this gets updated).
1
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Kriega1 (77) | May 23, 2019 9:19pm
Also Glad shield with blackthorn as well.
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Branmuffin17 (280) | March 20, 2019 11:55am
Hi UPLAR,

So...I noticed this was updated, and so read a bit through everything again, and sorta saw the 3rd build, then saw down at the bottom you gave me credit for it...and I'm guessing that build is based on my comment below that went as follows:
"One other thing I'm sort of interested in seeing is a crit/Qin's build for late-game. With an item slot opened up, could be nice. It would be along the lines of Devo's or BF + Exe + Qin's + PS or Rage + WD + DB (not in that order of course). But it would have to be really, really late game."

Is this assumption correct? Because if so, I need to clarify the build direction a bit better, and maybe suggest a couple build directions. Note that I had said "not in that order of course." It's important to understand build progression, and looking to optimize it as much as possible.

Right now, you have the build as Warrior Tabi, Devourer's Gauntlet, The Executioner, Qin's Sais, Rage, Wind Demon, then sell boots and get Deathbringer + Elixir of Speed. That isn't necessarily bad, but also not optimal IMO.
  • Option 1: Same up to Qin's Sais...but after that, in order to get MORE out of Qin's, I'd probably suggest Wind Demon due to the really nice AS boost, then Deathbringer (DB almost always as 2nd crit item), then sell Boots for Poisoned Star.

  • Option 2: Slight deviation, bypassing a late Poisoned Star, and instead get The Crusher or Silverbranch Bow after Devo's...will give better support to Qin's at the point you get Qin's online. Would look like: Warrior, Devo's, Crusher or Silver, Exe, Qin's, WD, sell boots get DB.

  • Option 2 (Crit v1 using Rage for high crit %): Crit route first, then add Qin's late. Warrior, Devo's, Exe, Rage, DB, WD, sell Boots and get Qin's (or get Qin's, then sell Boots and get WD...Qin's first if facing a lot of high health enemies).

  • Option 3 (Crit v2): More standard/popular crit route, though PS nerf sorta hurts. Warrior, Devo's, PS, Exe, DB, WD, sell boots for Qin's. Finish up your crit before getting Qin's to make it as reliable as possible. Qin's is just a nice bonus DPS boost.
1
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UPLAR (6) | March 25, 2019 3:58pm
Thanks for the feedback Bran, sorry btw for the very late reply I had some personal issues over the weekend, but I'm back to update the guide.

From the crit builds you've presented ,which I thank you for, I'm going to pick option 1 just because of the really nice PO and usefulness due to Wind Demon's and Poisoned Star's passive (the combination seems disgusting). Compared with the other options, I prefer this PO the most and I'll be updating the guide based upon it tomorrow afternoon, just before the guide contest ends.
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Branmuffin17 (280) | March 25, 2019 4:42pm
Cool beans, no problem on being late, it's your guide after all. Hope whatever you were dealing with is worked out.
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xmysterionz (43) | January 24, 2019 6:33am
Seems very solid overall. Kriega and Bran already said everything so just read their comments.

Congrats to your first guide, I hope you make others ;)

+1.
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[-]
UPLAR (6) | January 24, 2019 8:42am
Thanks mate that means alot! I'll be definitely improving the guide, based upon their feedback.
1
[-]
Kriega1 (77) | January 24, 2019 4:16am
Start is fine, but an alternative is: Mage's Blessing, Morningstar, health and mana/multi pots, and would give you a stronger laning phase early game.

Mage's blessing is better than Hunter's Blessing on AMC, especially since the not too distant change to it where it has physical power, and because the passive of mage's blessing also procs on AMC's passive.

Build 1 is fine of course. But Bloodforge and the other items can be replaced. Bloodforge can be swapped for Qins, Odysseus' Bow, qins can be swapped for beatstick etc...

Look at the top 4 builds from here (well the lower 3 of the top 4): https://smiteprobuilds.com/Builds?p_filters_page=1&p_filters_search=&p_filters_god=1956&p_filters_pro=~&p_filters_opponent=~&p_filters_role=~&p_filters_league=SPL&p_filters_sort=~

Also, another thing to realise is due to AMC's lack of a proper escape, getting Trans before boots on him is quite risky. I would probably get boots first if you get Mage's Blessing which is the safer route.

Start 2: Change to Mage's Blessing, Mace, pots.

Build 2: Not a very good build, my adjustments: Warrior Tabi, The Crusher, The Executioner, Qin's Sais, Titan's Bane, Odysseus' Bow or Bloodforge.

Lastly, I would get Honey at level 3 not level 4.
1
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UPLAR (6) | January 26, 2019 12:34pm
Updated!

I still kept my Silverbranch Bow build though as I've improved it's PO (as suggested by Bran) so its power curve is better, making it more viable. However I've added everything else you suggested.
1
[-]
Branmuffin17 (280) | January 24, 2019 11:12am
Ahhh, good point on Mage's Blessing, and on the safety of getting boots before Trans.

I know you're not a fan of Silver...my comments were based on an acceptance that UPLAR liked Silver. It's not something I'd typically get, but I can see the function.
1
[-]
UPLAR (6) | January 24, 2019 10:37am
Hey Kriega, thanks for the feedback. I'll be sure to include all the recommendations you gave where appropriate. I'll be combining all the advice from you and Bran to make this guide even better. I'll start to update this tomorrow.
1
[-]
Branmuffin17 (280) | January 23, 2019 9:15pm
Hi UPLAR,

Nice job on your first guide! It looks solid, visually, and it's organized well. Nano made a great guide that's pretty timeless.

On to the build.
  • Build 1 looks fine. I have no complaints about the items chosen, or the order purchased, as a general example build. As you note that the build is directly taken from Kriega, I would suggest confirming with him before taking the build, though. You do give credit, though, which is good.

  • Build 2 with the Boots start might be a bit inefficient, gold-value-wise, but I can understand the purpose for mobility as you describe. And since he has very little mobility, that might help a bit. But in that case, I know you're looking to build into Tabi and Crusher ASAP, but you might want to consider Hunter's Blessing instead of Mace...with no Trans, you'll be slightly starved for mana in longer lane stays, and the MP5, while minor, will be helpful. The attack speed will also be helpful since you're getting Warrior Tabi and your AS will be low until you get Crusher and higher levels in Hive.

    The full build example also looks fine overall. I don't know what your AS will be at full build, but if you are in fact overcapping, then Silver makes sense and can be helpful. It's also getting a decent buff for S6, along with crits probably being a bit weaker. Qin's is a great way to go overall. I do wonder if you might want lifesteal in some form, though.

    I'm not sure if O-Bow at this point of the build is best. It's not bad, but my preference would be AFTER Qin's Sais. The lack of power in the item hurts your power curve at that point, and the high AS won't be fully helpful until you have Qin's, which is the key item in the entire build for DPS.

  • Example full builds are great, but one thing you're perhaps missing is a secondary listing of items that might be purchased situationally, depending on the match and the enemy comp. Magi's Cloak for survivability, Brawler's Beat Stick for very, very easily applied anti-heal to lots of enemies at one time, Titan's Bane as full anti-tank function, and you might also want some lifesteal. Soul Eater could potentially work, and Devourer's Gauntlet is always a solid lifesteal item for basic attackers. You don't have to list all of these, like if you don't prefer Devo's...but some of these are key situational items.

  • Your skill leveling looks fine.

  • In a case where you're facing an Odin, you might consider Phantom Veil as a situational relic. Heavenly Wings can also be nice in upgraded form for the Fatalis (haste) effect, along with added MS since he doesn't have a good escape (and as backup in case his hives are taken down).

  • S6 is a couple weeks away or so. This will open up the possibility for Tabi replacement late-game with Elixir of Speed. Once it does hit, you will want to consider adding those extra item options for the late Tabi replacement.

  • In your build writeup for build 2, you mention choosing Warrior Tabi over Ninja Tabi just for the higher power, "making it the better item." You're probably right in most cases, especially as you prioritize The Crusher early. But note that the higher early AS not only benefits a late Silverbranch Bow, but also Qin's Sais that you build before it, as more hits = more passive damage procs. And then you don't have to worry as much about overcapping AS when you're adding Silver into your build. But...yeah...Warrior in the very early game is going to offer the better DPS, and a bit more oomph on your wave-clear Swarm due to 80% power scaling. If anything, I'd get Qin's, then O-Bow, then Silver (or situational). Or maybe it should be Silver then O-Bow (not sure what your AS will be at that point with full rank Hive.

  • In your early game writeup, you mention going for purple + harpies or raid the enemy's purple. I don't think you'll typically want to go all the way to the harpies (back harpies, I assume?). Mostly leave that for your Jungler to farm, and if anything, look to secure the oracles or help secure the red buff when you have the opportunity.

  • You talk late game about good points overall, but (and it might be obvious) the emphasis should be not to just go for Fire Giant, but more importantly, to stick with teammates. That's the biggest and most important thing for AMC, IMO.
Thoughts?
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UPLAR (6) | January 24, 2019 9:14am
Hey Bran, sorry for the late update I'm English so GMT and PST don't mix well, ah well regardless of that, thanks for you feedback! I'll definitely update the guide based upon it. However their are some points I want to clarify:

My reasoning for picking warror tabi over Ninja Tabi is because although yes Ninja Tabi benefits the passive of Silverbranch Bow, you actually gain more power with Warrior Tabi. Here is some evidence: Build 2's power with Warrior Tabi (while being level 20 and under the influence of Hive) is 263. However, Build 2's power (same conditions) with Ninja Tabi is 253 so theirs a 10 power difference there, not a major increase but its still 'better'.

Also some stats about the amount of stacks of Silverbranch Bow you get:

Build 2 (while being level 20 and under the influence of Hive) is 21 = 21 power.
Build 2 (while being level 20 and NO Hive) is 2 = 2 power

This is why i emphasise you ALWAYS play under the influence of Hive.

Through some testing I've found the most optical PO is Warrior Tabi // The Crusher // the executioner // [[qin's sais // Silverbranch Bow // Odysseus' Bow // (with hunters blessing being sold late game for Odysseus' Bow.

I agree that buying Qin's Sais helps your power curve, so I'll put that in before Odysseus' Bow. Through testing I've found if you get Odysseus' Bow before Silverbranch Bow, you actually overcap attack speed, (under the influence of Hive), without any benefit from Silverbranch Bow passive or base power stats. Therefore buying Silverbranch Bow first is better as you overcap your attack speed, (under the influence of Hive), and gain 2 stacks. Then you buy Odysseus' Bow, getting you the total of 21 stacks.
1
[-]
Branmuffin17 (280) | January 24, 2019 11:05am
Hey UPLAR,

My discussion on Warrior vs. Ninja was just based on how everything read, not that I disagreed with the item choice. To clarify, early-game, Warrior tends to be better, not just for ability scaling, but also just DPS as a whole. But as you build power with other items and delve into Qin's, the AS ends up being a bigger help. I covered this in detail in this post: https://www.smitefire.com/smite/forum/theory-crafting/adc-theory-crafting-balancing-power-amp-attack-speed-58650

So in the end, I was just sort of pointing out that Warrior isn't necessarily just straight better. It's better earlier, and maybe Ninja is a bit better late, at least S5. But with S6's eradication of late boots, we don't even have to worry about that. Just plan for early game efficiency.

Okay, so you're saying with a full build, Silver is putting your attack speed at 2.92 (technically)? If that's true, then we look at the final functional stats...
  • Under the influence of Hive: 2.5 (capped) AS, 41 power (51 in S6), 10 flat pen
  • No Hive: Allows you to be at 2.5 AS with just a bit extra, 22 power (32 in S6), 10 flat pen
If you go a different route and don't get Silver / AS, you'll probably cap under Hive, but it does give you other options for items. Question ends up being...is Silverbranch Bow truly worth it?

And that one is up in the air for me. The passive power when overcapped is nice, but what it's doing is giving you a tradeoff...hey, your build is inefficient because you blew past the AS, so you know what? I'll give you some extra power as a freebie. That tradeoff is questionable, and probably not optimal.

BUT...

What Silver DOES do for you is put you right at the cap when you don't have a Hive up. And depending on how well the enemy takes down your hives, or their retreat or yours moving you outside Hive range, that keeps your DPS potential basically at full...and that's worth something. In terms of other items that provide AS, Atalanta's Bow will have the same power in S6 as Silver, and will give you some MS, which is nice, but doesn't have any pen. Asi has no power (but does have lifesteal which you're missing in your 2nd build). I see it as an optional item that can be just fine, but isn't core.

I hear you on the purchase order...I hadn't calculated that out, and I'll take your word for it with those item options.

Overall, make no mistake, Qin's isn't just for power curve. It really is the centerpiece of the entire build. Where you get your biggest average DPS spike in a crit build when you have your 2nd crit item online, your biggest leap in a non-crit build is going to be when you build Qin's.

One other thing I'm sort of interested in seeing is a crit/Qin's build for late-game. With an item slot opened up, could be nice. It would be along the lines of Devo's or BF + Exe + Qin's + PS or Rage + WD + DB (not in that order of course). But it would have to be really, really late game.
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League of Legends Build Guide Author UPLAR
Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee - AMC Conquest Guide (WIP)
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SMITEFire is the place to find the perfect build guide to take your game to the next level. Learn how to play a new god, or fine tune your favorite SMITE gods’s build and strategy.

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