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Patch 5.13 "Mid Season" - Bran's Thoughts

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Forum » General Discussion » Patch 5.13 "Mid Season" - Bran's Thoughts 23 posts - page 2 of 3
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Branmuffin17 » July 13, 2018 4:08pm | Report
I honestly have no clue. This definitely increases base skill level for her use in some ways, and I expect some early mana struggles as people get used to her kit.

An early Chalice of Mana might help dumb things down and allow people to worry less about using Aurora Blade's ranged toggle, especially since her mana regen comes from melee attacks (which obviously makes her more exposed).

Until I actually try this out, though, I don't know exactly how bad the mana drain will be. It'll quickly become costly, as level 1's cost is 25 per shot, and level 3's cost is 41 per shot. (this means one Mana Potion will only support 3-4ish ranged shots, lol). Enemy gods can also reduce the effectiveness of that shot by getting in the middle of a wave. Sure, that'll hurt them, but bye-bye to your wave-clear.

The passive restores 6% of her MISSING mana, so it gets less effective as she uses it consecutively. If she's basically at 0 mana, a melee hit will restore 15 mana or so, which isn't even good enough for one ranged attack.

10 shots at level 5 will be 570 mana. That's pretty insane. This means she'll likely have to weave in and out of a fight, getting some ranged, then getting some melee, if she wants to remain effective.

Her base mana at level 1 is 257 (only 10 shots at level 1 before her mana is completely gone), and at level 20 is 960 (20 shots worth). She used to be able to easily get 10+ shots off a full Pulse channel when her attack speed was built up. I see MAJOR mana struggles ahead in theory, and likely cost reductions either before the patch hits, or shortly thereafter.

Book of Thoth is just not a generally suitable item for her, so it really is about that melee/ranged toggle.

As for her damage output...well, the single burst hit she can get from Northern Lights is nice, but damn if her burst is hindered. Consider that if both Pulse and Irradiate are activated at level 5 of each, she gets a combined 160 bonus damage, not counting scaling. Now, in ranged form, she'll only get 47...and even in the higher damage melee form, only 76. It's one or the other, so as of right now, although this is a really interesting rework, it seems like a huge nerf. It DOES help that Demonic and Telkhines have been recently buffed...but I'm feeling that in order to remain competitive if these stats remain the same, we would need to see a resurgence of the old Hastened Fatalis in Ring form (no CD).
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Stuke99 » July 13, 2018 4:34pm | Report
Welp, there goes my Ravana Guide.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Kriega1 » July 13, 2018 4:35pm | Report
xmysterionz wrote:


And last but not least finally they nerfed Baron Samedi and Zhong Kui, I hate both :)


They overnerfed Baron now. He's basically as bad as early season 4 Raijin now.
Rifts of Chaos - Chronos Conquest Guide

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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Tlaloc1050 » July 13, 2018 9:33pm | Report
I love the Jungle Practice changes. Now not only do we get to test out skins, we can now test out structure damage
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by DV-8 » July 13, 2018 9:49pm | Report
I'm most excited about Jungle Practice changes, as it is my most played game mode xD lol

Finally, no more slaying the Ra bot repetitively to build stacking items. And 5 man queue? We could do some interesting testing/theory crafting.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Tlaloc1050 » July 14, 2018 2:17am | Report
DV-8 wrote:

I'm most excited about Jungle Practice changes, as it is my most played game mode xD lol

Finally, no more slaying the Ra bot repetitively to build stacking items. And 5 man queue? We could do some interesting testing/theory crafting.


What platform're you on?
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Branmuffin17 » July 14, 2018 3:35am | Report
Okay, so I've likely drastically underestimated Freya's damage potential. And here are some other thoughts. (I'll likely make a video showing some of this later)

Early Mana Usage

So I went into PTS Jungle Practice, and, while her early mana usage using Aurora Blade is a concern, turning it off and hitting melee quickly fills it back up pretty well. This is in combination with the MP5 from Hunter's Blessing. Her big issue is going to be taking damage or getting locked down from CC, like Ymir's Frost Breath.

She'll absolutely need to use melee to maintain her mana, since that seems to be WAAAAY more efficient than getting Mana Potions. Basically, a few ranged, then switch to basics, if it's safe enough.

Because the damage increase isn't HUGE, you might conserve mana by only leveling Aurora Blade up to 3 or so, then switching to the added burst from Northern Lights. Not sure how that will feel on the speed of clearing waves, but it's something to experiment with.


Builds

This is what I'm proposing for ADC function:
Rangda's is an incredible damage booster. Combined with the flat boost from Telkhines, and her basic attack damage is fairly amazing.

The MS drop from Rangda's is offset mostly by the 3 rings (which have a total base MS of 25%). That MS drop actually puts her MS just slightly BELOW if she just had T3 shoes.


Damage Output

Okay, so...she seems to do a LOT of damage with her Northern Lights. The base damage is low, but the scaling is pretty good. I have to do some more damage comparisons though.

Old and new Freya build at level 1 is just Hunter's Blessing and T1 Shoes.

Old Freya build at level 20 is Hastened Ring, Demonic Grip, [[Bancroft's Talon, Spear of the Magus, Telkhines Ring, Rod of Tahuti (just for power/damage comparison purposes)

New Freya build at level 20 is Hastened Ring, Demonic Grip, [[Bancroft's Talon, Spear of the Magus, Telkhines Ring, Rangda's Mask

The below shows level 1 and level 20 (full build) comparisons against an Odin bot.

Basic Attack (meaning level 1 Aurora Blade for level 1, level 5 Aurora Blade for level 20, not active):
  • Old Freya, level 1: 39
  • Old Freya, level 20: 201
  • New Freya, level 1: 54
  • New Freya, level 20: 409

Pulse / Aurora Blade active:
  • Old Freya, level 1: 58
  • Old Freya, level 20: 338
  • New Freya, level 1: 50
  • New Freya, level 20: 356

Northern Lights without Aurora active (just to see this burst damage):
  • New Freya, level 1: 81
  • New Freya, level 20: 1,039

One thing to keep in mind is that Pulse used to stop on the first enemy hit, and have splash damage as long as Irradiate wasn't active. That splash damage was unlikely to hit 6 minions unless they were bunched up.

Aurora Blade in active state pierces and can hit the entire wave with normal spacing.

So...she's going to feel quite a bit different, especially juggling mana/health sustain functions, but I take back the feeling that she'd be significantly weaker. She's got much more burst potential here.


Role

So, with that burst, and the ability to pierce the entire wave...she's now a better candidate for Mid, I think. As before, she should be able to jungle as well. And...with sustain function...she might work for Solo, in getting that mana buff and probably opting for Chalice of Healing perhaps, but I don't know. Definitely interesting.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Wayne3100 » July 17, 2018 7:22am | Report
Added the new mask items:

Mask

Protector's Mask
Lono's Mask

Messenger's Mask
Bumba's Mask

Fighter's Mask
Rangda's Mask

If any of those are still showing the old icons, try refreshing by using Ctrl + F5 and let me know if the issue persists.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Branmuffin17 » July 17, 2018 10:54am | Report
WOOT. Thanks Wayne! Now I can complete my Freya guide (and items guide) XD
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Branmuffin17 » July 18, 2018 12:38am | Report
PTS Round 2 sees some adjustments to the masks and Freya's kit. Check it out.


Item Balance

Masks

Masks are intended to be a unique item for gods who want to flex into other classes/roles. We saw in Phase 1 of the PTS that masks were very rarely being used for this reason. Masks were overtuned in some ways (really?), which increased their problems on the PTS (hmmm, go figure), but the SMITE design team feels strongly that we should push Masks further into their intended role let's hear it for the design team!).

For this reason, Masks will now be strictly class locked to be only purchasable by gods who normally do the opposite role of the Mask. For example: Only tanky gods (warriors/guardians) will be able to buy the damage Mask (Rangda's) (time to nerf Cu Chulainn and Achilles again...). Although we might be sacrificing the widespread applications Masks had, we feel this is a safer and more interesting design direction (I guess it sort of is).

This may seem counterintuitive, but this is what enforces the class shift design. We feel that these masks would not be interesting additions to the game, even with their negative stats, if they became core damage items on damage gods. (Or core tank items on tank gods, etc) There are already plenty of items in SMITE that fit that role and we want Masks to be something distinctly different.

To compliment this design. Masks have had their stats and passives heavily adjusted. Please continue to share your feedback about these items as we move through the 5.13 PTS Testing Phases.

Protector’s Mask - Mage/Hunter/Assassin Only
  • 1200g
  • 50 Health
  • 15 Magical Protections
  • 15 Physical Protections
  • 10% CCR
Lono’s Mask - Mage/Hunter/Assassin Only
  • 2500g
  • 100 Health
  • 50 Magical Protections
  • 50 Physical Protections
  • 20% CCR
  • -25% Damage Dealt
  • +15% Damage Mitigation

    (Had fun the other night playing Nox support in Conquest...this might work out okay.)
Fighter’s Mask - Warrior/Guardian Only
  • 1200g
  • 10 Penetration
  • 20 Physical Power
  • 50 Magical Power
Rangda’s Mask - Warrior/Guardian Only
  • 2500g
  • 15 Penetration
  • 35 Physical Power
  • 70 Magical Power
  • +25% Damage Taken
  • +15% ability damage, +20% basic attack damage

    (A part of me breathes a sigh of relief, that we won't see insanely OP assassins and mages. That said... Bacchus is whispering in my ear right now that he wants to play really badly.) But does anyone else feel that the stat adjustment is a seriously heavy shift where the positives don't really make up for that negative? And no more triangle of weakness, huh? Now makes you take more damage while boosting your own. Dropped the pen and power down significantly. Eh, this isn't nearly as exciting. How long did it take the design team to think of that triangle, only to have it completely shot down in the first round of PTS?

Messenger’s Mask - Available to all Classes
  • 1200g
  • 10 Physical Power
  • 30 Magical Power
  • 10% Movement Speed
  • 10% CDR
Bumba’s Mask - Available to all Classes
  • 2500g
  • 20 Physical Power
  • 50 Magical Power
  • 20% CDR
  • +10% damage taken
  • -10% damage dealt
  • +35% movement speed

God Balance

Freya

Freya's rework went out a bit...bursty. We love the interaction with Aurora Blades pass through creating multiple explosions when paired with Northern Lights. It provides a solid increase in Wave Clear while allowing well positioned Freya players to find opportunities to punish opponents. However, the explosions dealing full damage was simply too much. Freya players can still deal more damage to enemies around minions, but the extra damage will be much more reasonable.

Additionally, we have a few fixes that should also help her perform more as expected. Outside of fixing some animation and FX issues, Aurora Blades now properly applies effects like Demonic Grip and does not proc items like Soul Reaver.

Mystic Warrior
  • Now heals off maximum mana / maximum health.

    This is better, depending on the %. Guessing the % values stayed the same for now, so this is a nice increase in sustain function.

Northern Lights
  • Each explosion past the first that hits a god will deal 25% of its total damage.
  • If hit by 3 explosions, a god would take full damage and then 2 hits that deal 25% of that full damage.

    This one confuses me a bit. The explosion radius shouldn't be all that big, and it's a one shot with a decent cooldown. What about any other god with a strong AOE that can hit multiple gods without seeing a decrease in its effect?

Aurora Blades
  • Fixed an issue where this ability could get into a bad state and fire incorrect animations / FX.
  • This ability will no longer proc ability based item passives, and will properly proc basic attack based item passives.

    Tlaloc, here's the part where that reference of someone's comment has been patched out, as I expected it would. No more proc-ing Mage's Blessing's passive on every hit of ranged Aurora Blades (which would have been absolutely stupid and broken if they kept that). Guessing it's Blades plural, rather than Blade. Meh, will have to adjust that in my Freya guide.

Bug Fixes
  • Issues with Ethereal Staff mana/health regen now work as intended.
  • The extra Neith bot has been removed from Jungle Practice Bot area.
  • Jungle Practice now has the correctly updated buffs
  • Kaldr now behaves correctly in Jungle Practice
  • Fixed an Issue with Freya's Ability 2 getting stuck in a bad state
  • Fixed an issue where red buff was healing too much
  • Ethereal Staff description updated
  • Ne Zha passive description updated
  • Sundering Spear description updated
  • Lono's Mask description updated
  • Freya's Passive text description updated
  • God mode in Jungle Practice now works with more than one player.
  • Jungle Practice lane minions no longer become immune after time has increased to above 30 minutes.
  • Unevolved Book of Thoth now gives the correct percentage of mana conversion.

Known Issues
  • Freya's Ability tooltips are missing updated information
  • Jungle Practice lane minions will spawn whenever the player leaps
  • Voodoo pedestal is missing its model
  • Commendation system is still in progress and will have issues.
  • Friends Lists, Match History, etc. are missing Queue Names
  • New skin portraits are displaying as placeholder images
  • Evolved Book of Thoth grants 1000 mana, but the store UI only shows 100.
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