Pendulum of Ages
: this is the starter you are going for when you want the highest damage output possible.
This item provides you the stat you need the most: CDR. (once fully upgrade, it gives you 20% CDR. Up from the basic starter giving you 10%)
It also gives you quite a bit of power through his passive. The more mana you have, the more power it gives you.
You are not building this for the power itself but you can skip [[chronos' pendant], allowing you to build another item that may be more useful (in case you want to get 1 health item) or more aggressive (like in the 1A build!)
In early game Sands of Time
will help you with mana regeneration making this starter item very strong in maps where you cant back too much like Assault or Conquest.
Spear of Desolation
: this item gives you penetration which is always really important to bypass the squishy protections.
Its passive outclasses all others penetration items for 1 reason: subtracting seconds to your abilities on all assists is like as helpfull as CDR, if not more. (not to mention that Spear of Desolation
also gives you 10% CDR!). (I think going for this item in a game mode like Arena, in a situation where you team is actually getting a good amount of kills, is absolutely a MUST)
: flat penetration is for squishies. While %penetration is for tanks! 15 magical penetration wont be much against tanks while %penetration will scale based on tanks protections.
Spear of the Magus
: a very goooood item!
The damage output coming from this time is strong indeed. The % pen will help you a lot against tanks and help you getting 40% pen in the build 1!
The item also have some lifesteal which is always helpful in game modes like Conquest, Slash or even Assault.
The passive will increase not only your damage but your whole team damage toward the marked target, making this item very strong in team fights especially when targeting a tank in order to melt it!
Tablet of Destinies
: this item is actually pretty great... BUT requires stacks! On Raijin stacking this item is quite easy even if you can gain a stack every 2 seconds for the simple reason that the dot from Raiju
make the item proc 2 times! (even the proc happens every 2 seconds!). The true damage coming from the item really helps against tanks and once paired with Book of Thoth
and Soul Reaver
it's quite deadly!
Book of Thoth
: the in-game item that provides the highest amount of power and mana. Once stacked it also gives you some flat which is helpful! It's faster to stack this rather than Tablet of Destinies
so get this as second as said above in the builds!
Overall Book of Thoth
gives you all the power you need (and otherwise lack) for the stacking build!
: this item can be swapped with the Charon's Coin
. I personally prefer Obsidian Shard
cause having extra 10% penetration on the first cast ability is amazing when you are targetting the tanks. Also you get a bit more power which never hurts!
: this item provides you with 8% movement speed compared to Obsidian Shard
but the passive doesnt help you against tank as efficiently, making Charon's Coin
slightly better to dodge abilties and auto attacks and Obsidian Shard
better against tanks!
Also Charon's Coin
should be built a lot earlier than Obsidian Shard
cause it requires stacks and in early game you dont really need %penetration.
By pairing this with Obsidian Shard
you can easily max out the %pen when you play into an enemy comp with 2 or 3 tanky enemies.
: this item gives you power and a very nice passive to annoy the tanky targets of the enemy team.
Some mages invest in some health as well sometimes (like Soul Gem
or Warlock's Staff
), making this item even more efficient! In that case you can consider taking this before Obsidian Shard
: you really want CDR! If you dont want to invest on other CDR item... having 20% CDR only from this is super awesome! Not to mention the passive that triggers every 10 seconds! (you can also swap the order between this and Spear of Desolation
. Early penetration is super good tho!)
: Raijin, beside having a big model, is very squishy, giving him health + health-steal (passive) is a great tool for staying alive and counter tanky targets! (note: also gives you a bit of CCR which helps in the tanky mage build!
: anti-heal is very important. If enemies have healers or high lifesteal-user gods... BUY IT
! This item also gives you penetration which is great! It also has a cool passive that will increase you aoe damage a bit and in late game, once you have a good amount of power, it deal's a solid amount of damage without much effort!
Look in the builds to check what to swap it for!
Relics: well... not much to talk about here:
: will cleanse you from any CC, mandatory relic. You can also use this relic before taking a CC since, after using it, you will be immune to them for 2 seconds. Purification Beads
has 2 upgrades. The first one is Temporal Beads
which will also reduce the CD or your abilities by 3 seconds making this super worth over Chaotic Beads
which will deal some damage to the enemy that applied the CC to you. You dont need to upgrade this relic beside some specific scenarios (like against gods that are gonna spam ultimate with strong lockdowns on you) but once you finished the whole build, it's a very good addition and can also be used aggressively to reduce the CD of your abilities!
Aegis of Acceleration
: making you immune to damage (you cant deal damage while immune). Use this to prevent huge burst of damage! Like above, you dont really need to upgrade this item but, once you dont have anything else to buy, you cant upgrade Aegis Amulet
into Aegis of Acceleration
to get some burst of speed which always turn out being good! On the other hand we have the other upgrade Aegis of Judgement
which is not worth going for since you wont deal much damage with it and you usually want to run away in a more safer ares instead of staying around to deal damage with it!
Tanky Mage items
I separate these items from the the other full mage build for the simple reason that you DONT want these in those aggresive builds! The only exception is Ethereal Staff
that can still be a solid niche item in the above builds!
: this is the go-to starter for the tanky build. The proc is veeeery big on tanks and making use of it on CD is quite simple on Raijin! Try to use it on tanks at the start of a team fight to maximize the effect!
: this item is actually quite big defensively and also helps A LOT allies with his aura! I dont really suggest to get this as starter item in case you want it over the Sundering Axe
but to get only the upgraded version later on!
: stacking this item will take time... but every time you an enemy, you will get 1 stack that will istantly gives an aura of 2 protection depending of the enemy you hit: if you a magical class you get a +2 magical prot aura stack, otherwise you get a +2 physical prot aura stack! In late game, once fully stacked, it will give an insanely good mitigation aura to everyone around you!
In early it will also still provide 10% CDR which is actually great to spam abilities more and more that will also help stacking Tablet of Destinies
: absolutely insane on Raijin... which is why this build isnt just for fun. Every targets you hit will proc this item and you actually hit MANY multiple targets with both Percussive Storm
! The damage dealt is based on the protections you have which is why going Lono's Mask
in some situation is better than Blood-Soaked Shroud
(it's really a 50/50 between the 2 starter items)!
: this is the optimal magical protection item you want. Gives you CDR and a passive that will also help to reduce cooldowns!
You can also just go for either Shogun's Kusari
, if you want to help the ADC, or Talisman of Energy
, in modes like Arena or Slash to increase mana regen and movement speed of everyone (in this case you will lose 10% CDR tho)!
: this item is quite good thansk to its passive. It will really help sustaining throught fights!
The only downside is that you will lose the damage coming from Sundering Axe
while also reducing the damage from Gladiator's Shield
cause it doesnt give you any protections.
You can go for this ONLY in case you want a lot of extra sustaing when your enemies doesnt really have anti-healing!
: these 2 items can be bought instead of Genji's Guard
in case you need anti-healing.
Keep in mind that the builds are not updated every patch and considering how big is next patch (10.6) in terms of balance, the builds will most likely change! :3
He shouldnt really struggle much in late game tbh. (you can also make a great use of the passive + desolation + chronos by cycling your rotation A LOT when you manage to get a couple of assist during a fight).
said that... surely the 20% scaling nerf hurt a lot... and i get that in some game modes outside of conquest (actually all game modes beside siege), many other mages, can shine a lot more (...and tbh the list is long). Raijin is still fairly decent in good hands tho.
As a suggestion... i can tell you that if you are in a good matchmaking game (so with everyone at the same level), try to focus more on melt their tanks cause Raijin can really shine there cause they cant threat you that much (especially when u build ethereal staff... and if you think that s the best way... get Soul Reaver after the obsidian shard).
DONT try to melt enemies squishy if all of them are up and are keeping an eye on you... cause you are gonna most likely get interrupted out of your 1 and/or 3 (when you try to escape): keep the distance, hit those tanks hard, and after the jungler/assassin or other bursty team mates nuke 1 squishy you can move more freely and, after you reset your abilities with spear of desolation/chronos pendant and your own passive, you can even jump in and delete 1/2 squishies yourself.
P.S. the tank build is not bad if you know what you are doing and have some experience as a bruiser (you are not fully a tank... lets say you are bruiser... something around a "solo" laner in terms of survivability). I personally played some high elo clash/arena as Raijin tanks (5man premade vs 5man premade) where i knew they could shut me down pretty easily... and i could have done a lot more by surviving their burst and spreading divine ruin and gem of isolation effects with my 2. The main issues is that your team mates need to know what you are going for ... otherwise they are just gonna blame you! ^^
hope this insight can help you a bit :D
Just saying solid guide overall, though I'm only really commenting on the standard build rather than the fun ones.
I do want to say that I agree with Kriega that situationally at least I think that Ob Shard is mentioned a bit late. I get your reasoning and you explained your side so that's fine, but Ob/Charon is going to be fairly functional by the 4th/5th item in most cases...squishies that build 0 prots and aren't affected by auras will have 48 at level 20, and that's good enough for the equivalent of ~10 flat pen, which isn't awful. And for tanks that have built at least 1 prot item, their prots will usually be over 100 at that point, so at least ~20 flat pen equivalence.
One thing I find weird, and I'm guessing you just made an error, is that Charon's Coin is listed in the Viable Items (less than 2 tanky targets) section.
Another thing that I think is an oversight is that you have Chronos' Pendant in the 6th slot. In your example build, that's overcapping CDR at least until you sell Mage's Blessing. One solution to that would be replacing Spear of Desolation in your build example with Divine Ruin. Anti-Heal is pretty common to pick up. I understand the synergy you're getting with Deso's passive and Raijin's passive, but maybe you might also consider pushing Chronos back one spot as a replacement for Mage's if you truly want to keep Deso in there...or I might be nitpicking since once you're getting CP you're going to be selling Mage's fairly quickly...or even straight up selling Mage's as you're completing CP.
I also think you're missing Pythagorem's Piece as an optional item.
Anyway, besides those, this seems pretty good overall. In the future, if you're looking to add more info, you might want to talk more about the combos you state, and you might add usage info to the item explanations (like where/when to buy them in the context of build order). And if talking about the contest, one major missing component here is gameplay.
in my opinion obsidian shard / charon coin is better as 5th/6th item (so actually after Chronos Pendant. i am gonna fix the fact that is shown as replacement for boots. i am gonna swap the position with tahuti). you really lose much damage on squishy and the pressure on tanks is usually enough before the late game (where you actually get the obsidian shard for). talking about enemy squishy: you have 15 pen from spear of desolation and 10% from SR, which is not bad. I think Raijin shines better with this kind of build where you prefer the utility of some items (like ethereal staff and SR ... or even gem of isolation later on) over early obsidian shard. (also you are talking about 4th/5th.... i d say 5th/6th so we are not diverging that much from it :P)
note: in S6 i used to get obsidian shard in all game modes as 4th items (and i was getting spear of the magus for extra pen even earlier). so i can definitely see your point. BUT in the current state of the game where many items lost their pen (shard got nerfed, magus got nerfed) and SR got buffed... i d rather go for a more healthy build (basically building around the ethereal staff, which trust me, IS GREAT) and getting the obsidian shard a bit later than i used to... to counter tanks even more while remaining safer in early stages of the game where raijin doesnt shine. (especially with warriors and assassin that harass you).
I actually thought about saying this in the guide itself... but if someone just started playing... it s kinda pointless to talk about other itemization and why i changed it. simply cause they dont know (and prob they dont care) about what happened before they started playing the game! :D
about the charons coin.... ye that s kinda a mistake xD or well... i expressed myself in a bad way. i remember why i said it but it s definitely something that can get wrong so i am going to fix it and change the words i used! (spoiler: basically i wanted to say that obsidian shard is a bit better cause provide a bit more % pen. while charons coin lose a bit of % pen and you get 10 more power. so charons coin is a bit better against squishy and obsidian shard is a bit better against tanks. so i definitely need to change that)
about overcapping the CDR. as you said at the end you are gonna sell back mage blessing. (well... if you bought it. i said it s kinda mandatory in most of games mode but in arena or clash you may skip it. i personally dont skip it but ... you know... maybe someone prefer to get booots).
If i have to be honest i also dont like much the fact that you wont make usage of the 10% CDR of the potion of power till you sell boots as well (which is basically the same reason you were talking about) BUT those 2 passive are just too strong. you can definitely waste 10% of overcap for those 2 passives. (yes... when you get chronos pendant you are gonna sell mage blessing VERY soon if not just selling it when you complete it, as you mentioned)
... And yes.... in MANY situations you get divine ruin instead of spear of desolation for the anti-healing so in that case you wont overcap! :D (i am not sure if i mentioned that you should get divine ruin specifically instead of spear of desolation... i am gonna check it!)
about phytagoream: i dont like it anymore. it was a cool item to build around and change a bit your itemization with the 10% CDR it used to have. now i didnt mention it cause i find it underwhelming over many many many other items. i d rather mention typhoon fang with bancroft if someone really want lifesteal ... or even book of the dead for an extra shield in game modes where maybe it can make a difference. but overall i dont suggest building these super niche items.
about gameplay: i think i basically talked about it in all the tips. that was my idea at least! infact i think there maaaany tips compared to other guides but that s cause i used them to also explain how to efficiently use raijin kit and so the gameplay!
about things like positioning (which is the other aspect of the gameplay) i said multiple times during the guide that Raijin is squishy and a safer placement is better (even in the tip for thunder crash). so... there s much of the gameplay in the tips and all along the guide! (also, as i said, it s general guide... not only for conquest. I didnt want to go for a game-mode specific guide. and i dont kinda want to add a part like that cause it would be redundant with tips. i dont want to repeat myself too much!)
About combos, same as above, i used tips for that :D (infact the combos was in the same chapter actually... but then an admin suggested not to use spoilers inside a spoiler.... so i moved it out of that chapter). (as an other example... you can see that i explained the combos about the ult itself ONLY in the tips... cause sadly there wasnt an icon for the multiple projectiles of the ult!)
About item order: well.. yes... i think i could be more direct about the order actually. even if as i mentioned in the guide... you can chose the order yourself and nothing is supermandatory cause all games are different. (i mean... if they have 5 tanks... you are gonna get that osbdian shard far earlier xD)
so... in conclusion... i try to fix all the things i said as soon as possible! (which is probabily now... gonna add more clearance and swap a couple of item position!)
happy you kinda liked it tho! :D was my first guide and already making it looking colorful was hard and took a lot of time xD (was totally new to the BBC code)
EDIT: i edited the guide: added more clarity and added 1 other build more damage oriented (same itemization but different order)!
Typhon's Fang is a good item to consider as well (good suggestion), but I think people still underestimate the bonus lifesteal and power it provides to nearby teammates (and you want to be close to teammates in later portions of any match. And while Typhon's is solid, none of his abilities are single target so not sure how strong it is to consider building 2 lifesteal items. Then again, with the ability for Raiju to spread, maybe it's worthwhile.
I do feel if you clarify a combo section then it's always good to have at least some quick discussions on it, rather than just the list. I did note you talking about combining abilities and how to do so in your skills writeup (really liked your explanations in that section), but even just a one-liner or brief paragraph under each combo would be good reference.
sometimes is cool... maybe you are low health and want to heal a bit up... you clear 1 wave with it + bancroft and you can do another fight. sadly, if you go for it it means you are gonna lose either CDR/passives or Health/SR ... which is not helpful. You prob gain more health with 1 ethereal staff proc than a 2+1 combo with lifesteal in teamfight (and count that you are gonna most likely have 2 ethereal proc even in a conquest)... so it s nice to discuss with you about lifesteal usage ... but i wouldnt suggest it in the guide itself xD (but well... maybe someone read the comments!)
note: there would also be Spear of the Magus that i also mention in the guide... but i highlighted it in red. like "ye it s not bad... but not worth it". I think i played it in like 1/2 games... it s prob as niche item as typhon... (basically if u build spear of the magus, you are snowballing and you dont need nor ethereal staff or SR or Doom Orb or Lifesteal and other items i mentioned xD) (and snowballing with Raijin is actually nearly impossible in good high elo match ups. you can still be lucky with kills tho :P)
about combo: well... later today i am gonna add some lines for it!
...and prob 1 small chapter about gameplay (even just positioning, and minion clear.. things like that). cause sadly Raijin is not very popular... and having a guide that i can update each patch to keep it fresh can be cool for everyone :D
Also... btw... i edited guide again and added lines for the combos... and most of all i added the gameplay chapter! :D (i would take a loot at it... there is a super secret ward usage for ARENA! U.U ... super worth reading!)
ofc if the enemy team has 3 tanks that has over 200 magical prot quite fast... well... you have no other choice by building Obsidian Shard [charon's coin]] ^^
Also don't build Estaff right after boots, please...
for the vast majority of the games modes you want it after desolation tho
basically in that case, with physical harassers, you want more sustain than damage itself: extra health, extra physical protection are what you need in order to survive and being more tanky.
Book of thoth can be a good call but it requires time to fully stacks it. while it gives you lot of power i wouldnt buy it over soulreaver and gem of isolation.
i think you can go for it in a couple of situations like : you know you can easily stacks it (conquest, even if it requires time; arena but you gotta be sure that people will let you stack, prob a bit faster); they dont have 2 tanky targets (outside of conquest and arena, enemies may only have 1 tank. which makes soulreaver less effective. it still gives you some pen tho. so be careful if you want to pick book instead of SR); enemies have plenty way to escape... jumps... leap... and so on, which makes gem of isolation less useful (especially with less than 2 tank)
i think i may add a paragraph there saying these things actually... may be something useful!
about mantle. it s not bad item and i was thinking about adding it in the fun support build. then i thought: "do u usually buy it?" ... no. even in the support build i chose the spirit robe cause you most likely gonna soak CCs and you dont use much the mantle of discord passive cause you are very tanky and not many things can nuke you with that build.
BUT i digressed a bit. lets go back to the "physical prot build". In that case you want to prevent assassin to kill you which makes mantle passive great. Still breastplate gives you 10% more CDR which is definitely worth over the mantle. in late game, once you bought the 500gold flask that gives you 10% extra CDR (so you ll still cap CDR which is really important!), you may consider buying mantle of discord especially in game modes without many many team fights like conquest and even siege (basically... you wont die much and you ll keep the effect of the potion without buying it again! :P)
P.s. even this things about mantle of discord can be added there i guess... i think they can help others as well ^^ interesting discussion :D
I wish you the best and good luck! :)
... i am not sure where i could add more organization tbh but i ll take a look again and try to improve it again ^^
about the paragraphs of the "leveling skills" well... that actually makes sense. I ll add it for sure :D
i added: spoilers to clean up that "big wall"! i added extra info about leveling order an abilities themself (as suggested above) and i added a section for combos always in the last chapter :D
if u have other suggestions i ll do my best to make it better :D
As for other suggestions, I see you've explained to Kriega your use of Ethereal Staff right after boots in a physical defense build. It would be nice if you could also add information like that to your guide. Add any detail of information you think is worth sharing to both players who are completely new to the character, and information that could benefit people who are looking to improve their Raijin. Maybe positioning tips, when and who to focus with Raijin, Raijin's Threats and Synergies. There's a tab in the God Builder specifically for threats, that would improve your guide a lot.
Thank you for listening to our feedback! It's heart warming when a creator listens to our insights instead of just bashing us. <3
i think now you should see all the things i modified! i pressed it! :D
if you have more suggestions now that you can see the whole changes (hopefully xD).... i still listen to them :D
For some final considerations, never put a spoiler inside another spoiler, like you did with the combos. When you open a spoiler, the spoiler inside it automatically opens as well. I would suggest you open another tab for the combos alone.
In your threats, you mention other gods in the description (Like in Hera you mention Scylla). You should try to avoid that, as most players tend to look a that the moment they know their enemy, and they might not have enought time to look at Hera and search Scylla to know what to do.
Aside from that, your guide looks amazing and I'm so grateful you're so responsive and eager to take our insights in. Good luck!
and yes... i was raelly looking forward for insights... when a guy asked me on reddit to post a guide here i was sceptical. when i noticed there actually wasnt a single guide for Raijin i wanted to contribute to it! i know he is not popular... but maybe someone will need some help :D