Charybdis - Build Examples & Release Analysis (Patch 8.8 Bonus Update)

Hi everyone,

I'm providing some standard build examples to try, based generally on meta and historically functional build types. I'll likely take this down after decent builds / guides are created.

Recent updates: 2021/9/10: Builds are current as of Patch 8.8 Bonus Update. Ichaival and Odysseus' Bow have gotten nerfed. While this doesn't mean they're not strong items for her anymore, this decreases the appeal of the meta bow build utilizing Silverbranch Bow.

• At max Tide, her passive Raging Tides gives her an attack speed increase of 0.24 (0.96 * 0.25). Her attacks per second is 0.96 (+ 1.6% per level), equaling 1.28 AS at level 20. With max Tide (which provides an additional 0.24 AS), this would be a max AS value of 0.24 + 1.28 = 1.52. AS from items totaling 100% will get her right to the edge of max AS.
  
  
• While having this semi-steroid in her kit can allow her to take some advantage of the meta Bow build, she'll get less out of it than some other gods that have stronger activated steroids, such as Artemis, Chernobog, Izanami, Rama, etc.
  
  
• Her basic attack progression is 1 / 1 / 0.33 / 0.33 / 0.33x. Her 3rd attack (technically 3rd, 4th, and 5th) is a much quicker succession of 3 basics at 3x the speed and 1/3 the damage. This allows her to take special advantage out of Odysseus' Bow procs, even if the damage is lessened.
  
  
• It also allows for full procs of Death's Toll / Death's Embrace. She gets enhanced use out of that starter, should you choose to go for it.

• This ability allows you to shoot through minions, making this your best wave-clear ability. However, an enemy god can stand in the wave and block this hitting the entire wave, though it's unlikely during laning that they'll want to take too much damage.
  
  
• Ichaival can be immediately stacked in the first attack if hitting multiple minions.
  
  
• Odysseus' Bow does NOT stack multiple times even when hitting multiple minions.

• Capsize provides up to 40% physical protection reduction at max Tide. This can provide some synergy with The Executioner especially against tanky enemies, should you choose to pick up that item.
  
  
• It's awkward to use in a teamfight as it interrupts your basic attack DPS. Instead, if you're going to use it against enemy gods, use it for fight initiation or when chasing an enemy instead of basics, as it won't slow your MS and it applies a slow itself. It can be useful when surprising an enemy around a corner.
  
  
• Best use is as a debuff for jungle objectives (GF, FG).

• After a short windup, this ability makes you untargetable for up to 3 seconds. Use this when necessary to get from a dangerous area into a safer location near teammates.
  
  
• It can also be used as your chase ability due to the increased MS, though this should only be in situations where you're otherwise going to be safe.
  
  
• Note that it's a short windup...you can't use this like a Chang'e or Ravana 2 to immediately get out of incoming damage. Plan ahead if you need to.

• When triggered, this ability feels and acts a lot like Scylla's ultimate, in that it provides CC immunity and MS. When she attacks, the ability shoots in a fairly narrow line, pushing any enemy it connects with back and dealing damage, then dealing much higher damage and stunning enemies once it gets to the max targeted range. If she gets a kill from this ability, just like Scylla it recharges her ult duration and allows her to attack with it again.
  
  
• Note that you determine its max range. Shoot it the max distance when trying for multiple enemies at different ranges, or for attempting to self-peel an enemy that's on your back. You can aim nearer if you want to keep the enemy close, which is better when you're targeting a single enemy and looking for a kill.
  
  
• Just like with Scylla, don't just use this to deal damage. The 6 seconds w/ 35% MS and CC immunity can help you get away from a dangerous situation, especially when your Whirlpool Form is on cooldown. Offensively, you can use it to chase a lower-health enemy to attempt to finish them off.

• Leather Cowl -> Hunter's Cowl: This build direction is currently the most common. It's fine, but not exciting. It does mean, at full build with teammates around, that she only really needs 2 AS items to get around max AS.
  
  If you use this in a bow build, it's a very nice boost to a Silverbranch Bow passive. However, I don't feel the standard bow build w/ Silver is her best direction. She's already getting potentially less damage from Qin's Sais. Note that anything past 2.5 AS, you're getting 0 added benefit from Odysseus' Bow procs or Qin's procs.
  
  
• Gilded Arrow -> Ornate Arrow: I feel this gives her the most DPS potential. She feels a bit underwhelming on damage output, so crits are nice for burst and against jungle objectives.
  
  
• Death's Toll -> Death's Embrace: By far, she gets the most out of this passive of any hunter outside of Izanami. Of course, you want close to max 2.5 AS, but she fully procs on each of her basics (including the 3 quick attacks). Crazy to heal up w/ minions/camps.

• Ichaival: Very nice synergy. Stacks normally at the start of a normal attack chain, but stacks instantly if using Spike Shot on a wave with 3 or more minions.
  
  
• Odysseus' Bow: Extremely high synergy. Due to the rapid 3rd/4th/5th attacks in the normal attack progression, it can proc more quickly than with any other god. The procs are decreased, sadly enough, when you activate Spike Shot, since it turns attack progression off for the duration.
  
  
• Qin's Sais: Potentially has slightly higher damage output for the passive IF you use your normal attacks, and IF you hit every single attack. If you don't, you're getting decreased damage potential. Also, when you activate Spike Shot, while your progression is off, it doesn't revert the damage nerf.
  
  
• Wind Demon + Deathbringer: If you opt into a crit build using the Gilded Arrow / Ornate Arrow path, these are your core crit items.
  
  
• Rage + Deathbringer: If you opt into a crit build using the Leather Cowl / Hunter's Cowl path, this is your suggested core crit combo to provide increased crit chance. You'll want the rest of your items to provide attack speed and penetration.

As of September 10th, Casual Smite reports that:

• Charybdis has a Casual Conquest win rate of 45.72%, good for 113th place, even with 1st place popularity. While this can indicate a kit that is complex with a high skill floor and takes a while to learn, this is very unlikely to be the case with Charybdis. Instead, it is more likely that she is an underpowered release god.
  
  
• Ichaival, Odysseus' Bow, Asi, Wind Demon, and Deathbringer are the 5 most popularly built items for her. Leather Cowl / Hunter's Cowl is the most popular starter / upgrade path.

• Overall State: I expect Charybdis to get some immediate buffs starting with the next patch.
  
  
• Quality of Life Improvements: I feel that some abilities feel very strong in some situations, and extremely weak in others. Adjustments to how these abilities work / activate / flow will be key to her kit's quality.
  
  
• Raging Tides Adjustment: The problem with this lies in the attack progression with 3rd/4th/5th attacks. It makes procs from Odysseus' Bow crazy, and due to the much quicker progression, makes it require the damage proc nerf, which causes issues of its own (see in Spike Shot discussion). I don't know that they can adjust this, but as a base it causes mechanical issues.
  
  
• Spike Shot Adjustment: This ability feels generally strong, especially against enemy minions. Once leveled enough and with a full T3 item in hand, the clear potential is very high, though Izanami still has the upper hand due to not having to activate anything to have the same effect. It fully stacks Ichaival in one hit against a wave.
  
  At the same time, while it's also nice to use against enemy gods due to the extra damage from spikes on impact and the wider hit box, it doesn't feel all that strong. Funny enough, if you're going with a build including item damage procs like Qin's Sais, you're actually nerfing that item's damage potential when you activate the 1, because the damage reduction still applies, but you're no longer attacking with the quicker attacks, thus getting less procs overall.
  
  
• Capsize Adjustment: This has a wide cone but short range. Basically, if you're charging the ability for max effect, you're exposing yourself to damage AND not dealing damage of your own. This poses a major issue for fighting against enemy gods. You might argue that the protection reduction is worth it, but against squishy, high damage targets, you're just setting yourself up for a quick death.
  
  Right now, you best use it initiating against an enemy that isn't expecting you, meaning surprising them at short range around a corner. In the middle of a fight, it's only functional if you're winning the fight or your only nearby target is a tankier god. It's also okay to use against an FG / GF to allow other phys teammates to deal more damage (albeit for a short time).
  
  All in all, it's just an awkward ability, not best suited for fighting. How can they fix? Maybe make the cone narrower but slightly longer range than standard ranged basics...maybe 65 units or so. They could decrease the protection reduction but make it last longer.
  
  
• Whirlpool Form Adjustment: This is fairly OP for safety, and very underwhelming for offense. The exit damage is nice if you amplify the ability, but you're then much more exposed with no safety, so it's only helpful in fights you're likely to win as an offensive tool.
  
  It's just too easy to get out of a lot of damage, and it lasts for a long time. I feel the defensive aspect should be nerfed, and there should be incentives to use it offensively. Ideas:
  
  - Decrease submerge time from 3s to 2s.
  - Start CD at activation, and maybe add effect that each tick of amplified damage decreases CD of the ability or something.
  - Instead of becoming immune, maybe the maw surrounds her and mitigates damage and provides CC reduction instead of completely blocking damage and effects. I mean, she already has CC immunity in her ult. 2 abilities that do that? Bleh.
  
  
• The Maw Hungers Adjustment: Ability has a delay when casting the damage portion. It needs to flow more smoothly. It's also stopped weirdly when aiming along a wall. This whole thing just needs to feel different and smoother.