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Balancing Discussion: The Real Deal

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Forum » General Discussion » Balancing Discussion: The Real Deal 384 posts - page 27 of 39
Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Aphnex » August 25, 2014 10:33pm | Report
Thanatos is actually pretty decent right now. Maybe make his skills a little more costly.

Aphnex


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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Pentargonite » August 26, 2014 2:51am | Report
Thanatos is absolutely fine....
If anything he's UP, since I rarely see him in tourneys or high level ranked.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by ICEN » August 26, 2014 3:18am | Report
Pentargonite wrote:

Thanatos is absolutely fine....
If anything he's UP, since I rarely see him in tourneys or high level ranked.
UP MY *** big time....

I cannot say how this is wrong, this is worst the people saying Zeus was not bad before the pros starting playing Zeus then everyone was on Zeus's D riding him to the point THAT HE NEEDED A DAMN NERF!!!!

Do you guys not remember? I thought Zeus was trash aka Garbage yet he got tourney love to the point he needed NERFS>.......

Thanatos is WORST then Zeus and STRONGER than Zeus was and still stronger.

I don't care if someone plays or doesn't play him, Thanatos's ult is plain BS legit BS.

Thantaos ult was suppose to be something that gets him killed if he doesn't kill with it.

Yet 1000% of good players who play Thanatos can kill you with the ULT on FULL HP.

Yes does that seem Under powered going from 100% Hp down to dead in less than 3 seconds???

Thanatos is FAR from under powered, he is strong as hell its insulting to call him under powered.

In my eyes calling thanatos under powered is the same as calling Ra the worst god in the game.

Thanatos ult drops on you, he stuns you with it and you are on full health, the stun last long enough that he can get a free 1 on you which deals insane massive damage, more damage then damn mages can do and on top of this he can 3 you then go into 2 and your dead within 1-3 seconds.

Thantaos is not under powered, he gains HP from killing minions, he gains immunity to ALL SLOWS, he gains penetrations, he has a high damaging silence cone ability, he has a freaking 1 that does insane damage and insane instant healing on top of that a damn slow!!!

Most of all, his ult can kill anyone that's under 40% HP INSTATNLY... does that sound Under powered?

* Does healing off of kills sound under powered?
* Does killing anything under 40% HP sound under powered?
* Does gaining increased movement speed and IMMUNITY to slows sound under powered?
* Does his 1 giving massive damage more than mages and instant healing sound under powered?
* Does his 3 silence cone that does good damage sound under powered?

* Does the fact that even if you are NOT under 40% HP Thanatos ult will auto kill you with his combo and you can't do anything about it without actives and even then you will still probably die sound under powered????

OMG you guys do not understand the power of Thanatos, he is the one god I don't want to see on the enemy team, I sound like I am raging but its because you have to be blind to see how strong he is, just because hes not played in ranked does not mean anything, I refer to him as the old Zeus was looked at but STRONGER WAAAAAAAY STRONGER.

By the way thanatos ult is not easy to dodge, I can joust anyone and we can test it.
I buy max cooldown and lets see out of 10 ults how many people can dodge.

The person playing Thanatos gets 10 ults and the other player has to see how many out of those 10 he can dodge.

I am willing to bet a lot of us can almost get perfect 10 out of 10 thanatos ults because honestly its not that hard to land, lets be real? How often do you miss Thanatos ults on low hp targets and how many times do they miss it on you?

Nubs don't count :D

Not trying to rage but thanatos is NOT under powered HELL no he is not.

I never see someone call THanatos under powered when they run for their lifes every time they hear him coming. Funny how dat works round here XD

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Devampi » August 26, 2014 3:40am | Report
I agree with ICEN even if he falls of late game his combo is killing a squishy with a 4-1-3 nd the bad thing as mage you can't do anything then basic attack before the silence is gone your most likely death by his 2 (or you got killed by his 3)

btw ICEN dodging depends on you know how close thana is and you have a good escape ready.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by HolyPudding » August 26, 2014 4:25am | Report
ICEN wrote:

UP MY *** big time....

I cannot say how this is wrong, this is worst the people saying Zeus was not bad before the pros starting playing Zeus then everyone was on Zeus's D riding him to the point THAT HE NEEDED A DAMN NERF!!!!

Do you guys not remember? I thought Zeus was trash aka Garbage yet he got tourney love to the point he needed NERFS>.......

Thanatos is WORST then Zeus and STRONGER than Zeus was and still stronger.

I don't care if someone plays or doesn't play him, Thanatos's ult is plain BS legit BS.

Thantaos ult was suppose to be something that gets him killed if he doesn't kill with it.

Yet 1000% of good players who play Thanatos can kill you with the ULT on FULL HP.

Yes does that seem Under powered going from 100% Hp down to dead in less than 3 seconds???

Thanatos is FAR from under powered, he is strong as hell its insulting to call him under powered.

In my eyes calling thanatos under powered is the same as calling Ra the worst god in the game.

Thanatos ult drops on you, he stuns you with it and you are on full health, the stun last long enough that he can get a free 1 on you which deals insane massive damage, more damage then damn mages can do and on top of this he can 3 you then go into 2 and your dead within 1-3 seconds.

Thantaos is not under powered, he gains HP from killing minions, he gains immunity to ALL SLOWS, he gains penetrations, he has a high damaging silence cone ability, he has a freaking 1 that does insane damage and insane instant healing on top of that a damn slow!!!

Most of all, his ult can kill anyone that's under 40% HP INSTATNLY... does that sound Under powered?

* Does healing off of kills sound under powered?
* Does killing anything under 40% HP sound under powered?
* Does gaining increased movement speed and IMMUNITY to slows sound under powered?
* Does his 1 giving massive damage more than mages and instant healing sound under powered?
* Does his 3 silence cone that does good damage sound under powered?

* Does the fact that even if you are NOT under 40% HP Thanatos ult will auto kill you with his combo and you can't do anything about it without actives and even then you will still probably die sound under powered????

OMG you guys do not understand the power of Thanatos, he is the one god I don't want to see on the enemy team, I sound like I am raging but its because you have to be blind to see how strong he is, just because hes not played in ranked does not mean anything, I refer to him as the old Zeus was looked at but STRONGER WAAAAAAAY STRONGER.

By the way thanatos ult is not easy to dodge, I can joust anyone and we can test it.
I buy max cooldown and lets see out of 10 ults how many people can dodge.

The person playing Thanatos gets 10 ults and the other player has to see how many out of those 10 he can dodge.

I am willing to bet a lot of us can almost get perfect 10 out of 10 thanatos ults because honestly its not that hard to land, lets be real? How often do you miss Thanatos ults on low hp targets and how many times do they miss it on you?

Nubs don't count :D

Not trying to rage but thanatos is NOT under powered HELL no he is not.

I never see someone call THanatos under powered when they run for their lifes every time they hear him coming. Funny how dat works round here XD


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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Nex The Slayer » August 26, 2014 7:29am | Report
I really don't get why Hi-rez gave an ultimate that is clearly designed to finish people of a stun -_-

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Pentargonite » August 26, 2014 10:32am | Report
*sigh*....

ICEN wrote:

Thantaos ult was suppose to be something that gets him killed if he doesn't kill with it.

Yet 1000% of good players who play Thanatos can kill you with the ULT on FULL HP.

Yes does that seem Under powered going from 100% Hp down to dead in less than 3 seconds???

Yeah well either you're really bad or you (or your team) fed Thanatos. If he's not fed, he's never able to do that. If you have a jump, you can easily avoid his ult if you have a bit of skill. Maybe Greater Sprint even works (probably not).
ICEN wrote:

Thanatos is FAR from under powered, he is strong as hell its insulting to call him under powered.

I said IF ANYTHING, HE'S UNDERPOWERED. Which means, I think he's fine, but if I had to choose between op and up, he's up.

ICEN wrote:

Thanatos ult drops on you, he stuns you with it and you are on full health, the stun last long enough that he can get a free 1 on you which deals insane massive damage, more damage then damn mages can do and on top of this he can 3 you then go into 2 and your dead within 1-3 seconds.

Can you stop over exaggerating everything? This is NOT. TRUE. He can only do this if he's fed, and if you just ward your ****ing lane and play passive till mid game YOU'RE FINE.

ICEN wrote:

Thantaos is not under powered, he gains HP from killing minions, he gains immunity to ALL SLOWS, he gains penetrations, he has a high damaging silence cone ability, he has a freaking 1 that does insane damage and insane instant healing on top of that a damn slow!!!

But if an Ymir stuns him in duo lane he's ****ing dead.

ICEN wrote:

Most of all, his ult can kill anyone that's under 40% HP INSTATNLY... does that sound Under powered?

Already replied to this.
ICEN wrote:

* Does healing off of kills sound under powered?

Did you want him to have 35 crit chance like Infused Strikes then? Or maybe Mercury's passive? It's his sustain. Instead of a damaging passive, he gets a sustaining one.
ICEN wrote:

* Does killing anything under 40% HP sound under powered?

Again, already replied
ICEN wrote:

* Does gaining increased movement speed and IMMUNITY to slows sound under powered?

I'll give you that.
ICEN wrote:

* Does his 1 giving massive damage more than mages and instant healing sound under powered?

Doesn't do massive damage when not fed, healing might be a bit too much.
ICEN wrote:

* Does his 3 silence cone that does good damage sound under powered?

Did you want him to have a stun like Kali, Thor or Fenrir. Cuz I can already imagine people crying even harder if he had a stun.
ICEN wrote:

* Does the fact that even if you are NOT under 40% HP Thanatos ult will auto kill you with his combo and you can't do anything about it without actives and even then you will still probably die sound under powered????

Again: Jumps, wards and CC.
ICEN wrote:

just because hes not played in ranked does not mean anything,

LOL.
It clearly does, everyone in ranked plays to win. To win you play the most op gods ever. Well if Thanatos isn't played he's not op right?

ICEN wrote:

By the way thanatos ult is not easy to dodge, I can joust anyone and we can test it.
I buy max cooldown and lets see out of 10 ults how many people can dodge.

I think it's kinda easy with a movement speed skill.
ICEN wrote:

Not trying to rage but thanatos is NOT under powered HELL no he is not.

No? Doesn't seem like you're raging... *cough*

I hate writing long paragraphs.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Subzero008 » August 26, 2014 10:41am | Report
Okay, I'm going to try to summarize Thanatos.

Firstly, to make everything clear, I will say this: Thanatos is not the best assassin. In fact, he is nowhere near that. He's mid-tier, at best.


What he's GOOD at:
- Early game damage: He hurts tons early game.
- Sustain in the Jungle: He effectively has no mana costs, has passive and skill-based heals.
- Finishing off weakened enemies: His DEATH-Dar is great for this, and the bonuses he gets from cleaning up enemies can keep him going.


What he's OKAY at:
- Initiation: Early game, he can gank with this. LATE game...not so much.
- Chasing: He's good at doing this to weakened opponents, but, say, when chasing someone at 40% health early game...he's not that great.
- Cleaning up: The problem is, Thanatos has no escapes and stuff, and his damage late game, aka for teamfights, honestly is not that great. He also relies heavily on his ultimate for this
- Shutting Down Enemies: He's great for shutting down carries early, but so can other junglers.
- Early Ganks: He's pretty good at this, but so can Mercury. Or Ymir, or Athena. And Smite has a very bad environment for early ganks, due to how much the minions hurt as well as the pressure to stay alive for the mid camps. If he had some way to bypass minions like Mercury, or stupid amounts of CC, like Mercury, this would be more than an "okay."
- Teamfights: His CC isn't bad at all. It's not great, as physical gods can still easily kill you (at least, when you're at the point where your damage falls off), along with gods with steroids like Freya. But at the same time, his AoE silence contributes a lot to a teamfight, although it does become pretty weak later.


What he's BAD at:
- Mid-Late game damage: THIS, right here, is what makes Thanatos, in my eyes, only mediocre at best. Okay, his early game is terrifying, but his damage falls off SO hard, it falls off at MID game. Like, this weakens everything he does. His cleanup potential falls off, his ganking starts to suck, he can't initiate anymore, he can't shut down enemies anymore, he no longer has monster damage, and even his ability to finish off enemies is weakened when an entire team is preparing to kill you on landing. He also becomes the WORST nontank duelist in the game. The only thing that remains relevant is his ability to chase and finish off enemies, speaking as an assassin, and even then, gods like Mercury outclass him here.

Basically, late game, he's literally the worst assassin, because at least Arachne can Blitzcrank someone into instant death.


Harvester of Souls: This passive is just badly designed. Like, it encourages kill stealing, and in fact, makes it a form of survival for Thanatos, which is an anti-fun and pro-frustration mechanic. It's good for sustain, and chasing, I guess, but that's about it.

Death Scythe: Single target massive early game nuke that also heals. It's frankly overpowered early game, easily taking out 25% of someone's health and healing about 15% of your own health. If you rank it up first, it can half-health some gods. But at the same time, its scalings suck ***, and even the percentage health damage starts to fall off late game. Yes, it'll chunk about 20% of a squishy's health, but late game autoattack crits can chunk for 30% or more, and some abilities do even more than that.

Scent of Death: This is honestly a weird buff. You want to use it before you attack due to the pen, but at the same time, you want to save it for escaping or chasing. It's just a weird ability that clashes with itself. The slow immunity is great...if it were in any MOBA but Smite. The slow immunity is only significant against a few specific gods, and against others, its useless.

Soul Reap: An AoE silence nuke that deals okay damage. It's one of the clearly fantastic abilities he has.

Hovering Death: This is honestly a fairly good ultimate, but yeah, the stun on it makes little sense. However, the problem is that without the stun, Thanatos has VERY big problems ganking or initiating ganks. Without the stun, it just becomes a ****ty escape early game, and nothing else. Not to mention, HiRez made the brilliant decision of giving an early-game focused assassin one of the worst rank 1 ultimate in the game, when used for its intended purpose of execution. Brilliant. /slowclapping

As a general note, the itemization meta for junglers encourage autoattacks. Thanatos, however, relies a **** ton on his abilities, in a game where everyone builds crits and Sais and lifesteal.

On another note, Thanatos has the most messed up numbers in the game. He's an assassin, and has an assassin's kit and CC, but he has high base damage and some of the worst scaling in the game, making him a terrible assassin since you get so little from stacking power. No wonder he's forced to build crits in order to remain significant.

I suggest, like I will eventually suggest for Fenrir, that we focus on making him an ability assassin, without shoving crits somewhere or giving him an attack speed buff or some other ********.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Subzero008 » August 26, 2014 10:43am | Report
Kadius wrote:

He's fine honestly but I think that they should remove his life steal from minion kills and replace it with movement speed (he has wings ffs).

I agree with Firraria that making it proc on minions would be a bad thing, but I do like the idea of giving him bonus speed after a kill. It could make him less suicidal when ganking.

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Permalink | Quote | PM | +Rep by Subzero008 » August 26, 2014 10:44am | Report
Aphnex wrote:

Thanatos is actually pretty decent right now. Maybe make his skills a little more costly.

I disagree. I think he's underrated, but subpar all the same.

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