Dissecting Smite #1: Oversexualization, Stereotyping, Double-Standards, and Other Misogyny in Smite :: Page 15

Forum » General Discussion » Dissecting Smite #1: Oversexualization, Stereotyping, Double-Standards, and Other Misogyny in Smite 305 posts - page 15 of 31

wrote:

A thing I would like to add. It's in more things in the world then only games. But you guys are all like we don't pay attention to how looks but what oa kuang is building.

THIS IS ONLY THE CONSCIOUS PART OF YOUR MIND

If we are going to have it about the unconscious part (which is like 80% of your mind) the story is different.

so if you are watching a movie or playing a game (even reading books) when like the movie uses a mac (silent reclame or how it's called in English) you yourself doesn't notice it but your brain does. the point this has is to let people buy macs (so they promote macs)

In games etc we have this too with the topic we're talking about. you yourself doesn't pay as much attention too it but your brain still does. so a lot of games are actually promoting sex (and most of these games who take this (too) far) mostly have a age rating of 16. The only thing smite has is a warning that it can contain inappropriate content for children (while other games normally also list what's in it like use of alcohol an partial nudity etc)

That's called sub conscious marketing and is actually something most major corporations spend millions on. It can be as simple as making a soda bottle red, or blue. Like Coca cola and Pepsi. Simply because when a consumer sees the red, or blue. It stands out more than a color like white, or black and influences your decision making on something as simple as color.

It also goes more in depth like what Victoria's Secret does with their marketing techniques. They get beautiful women to model their underwear and post it all around the store. That way when the consumer walks in they see a super sexy woman in this underwear. Sub consciously your mind sees that as that underwear is sexy. Meaning you are more likely to buy it as it seems it would make you feel sexier.

http://www.magnatar.nl/Magnatar/Brain_food/Artikelen/2011/8/18_Marketing_Metaphoria_-_Zaltman_files/howcustomersthink.pdf

Here's an article on that too. So what you said is fairly accurate. They are; in a way, promoting sex. However, it does have all the warning labels on ESRB rating. What I don't get is how it got away with rated T instead of M. As it includes many of the same things that rated M games, like GTA5 include.

Prominent (31)
Posts: 624
View My Blog

wrote:

First of all, I'd like to point out that this article, and these studies were all performed and written by PhD's in a related field. They are published by a top tier college. I highly doubt this article went without being reviewed by many other top researchers in the field before being published.

Not only that, but I want your proof. I want proof that it is flawed. Not something you came up with off the top of your head. You aren't a master in the field, or on the topic, and you have no credibility. I still haven't seen any sources for your information.

The fact that it's written by people with a PHD is an irrelevant appeal to authority. Academics can always be wrong, regardless of their background. Plenty of articles - and I mean plenty - go through the peer review process and remain weak. That is because the process itself is fundamentally flawed in a number of ways.

As I said, I'll discuss it tomorrow. I'm still tackling Sub's massive post.

Remarkable (9)
Posts: 166

wrote:

Aeadar returns! :D

I used to actually debate on a team. Too bad I quit lol. I'm liking the discussion (ignoring the mudslinging) so far. I actually do worship some of the Hindu gods (Kali and Rama), so I'm interested to see what you guys will say.

You're polytheistic.................. that's actually pretty cool lol.

Seeing as how it's in topic and seeing as how you worship her, what was your standing on the old Kali scandal? (Sorry if this question is inappropriate or uncomfortable)

What my yearbook quote should be: "Fluorine Uranium Carbon Potassium Ytrrium Oxygen Uranium Bismuth Technetium Einsteinium"

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Memorable (13)
Posts: 617
View My Blog

I don't mean to sound insulting, but reading these deep and complicated debates about a video game is just... Funny.

Guides I have written:

The Complete Beginner's Guide to SMITE!

To Kill a Mockingbird of Nope: Sun Wukong Solo and Support Guide

A Guide to Xbalanque: The Hidden Jaguar

Fenrir: The Ultimate Jungle Guide

Arachne: The Ultimate Jungle Guide

If my post helped you out,
then drop me a +rep! :D

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Distinguished (58)
Posts: 980
View My Blog

wrote:

I honestly didn't care. She was fine - I also don't worship Kali that much like. Technically we are a polytheistic religion but we believe that the many gods are aspects/personalities of the single God. And that single God can be anyone you want it to be. For me that is rama/vamana/krishna which are pretty much the same thing just different incarnations . I've never heard of vamana before the game though.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (105)
Posts: 2640
View My Blog

see next page - technical difficulties. For some reason a massive chunk [3/4s] of my reply has been cut-off prematurely.

Remarkable (9)
Posts: 166

wrote:

Test. For some reason a massive chunk [3/4s] of my reply has been cut-off prematurely.

It's likely too long with all the quotes, but I've confirmed that it's all still there by quoting. Just separate it into smaller posts and you should be golden.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Esteemed (96)
Posts: 2246
View My Blog

wrote:

It's likely too long with all the quotes, but I've confirmed that it's all still there by quoting. Just separate it into smaller posts and you should be golden.

I tried and it was only showing one quote. I may work now that we're on a new page. To be fair, it is horrifically long.

Let's try: Edit: it appears to still be broken.

wrote:

Firstly, you completely ignore how Smite ignores lore for the gods and not for the goddesses. What difference does it make that Smite draws from the real world? HiRez puts PLENTY of artistic license on the game anyway. As I mentioned in the OP, it's hypocritical to not show Zeus as a raging man **** when Freya remains "faithful" to the lore by being practically naked.

Remarkable (9)
Posts: 166

I copied it to make sure, and am sending you a private message with everything in case you accidentally lost it.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Esteemed (96)
Posts: 2246
View My Blog

I'll just do a TL;DR type post, Since my response was way to big. So these points will be basic:

With regards to men also being over-sexualised - some popular examples:
Magic mike
Game of Thrones
American Horror Story Freak Show
Merlin

It exists. Is it a wide-spread issue or serious? I don't know. I have no evidence comparing male and female advantages and disadvantages fairly, so I won't comment.

With regards to internalized sexism and culture:

Can culture affect us severely in some sub-conscious way? Maybe. It would be incredibly difficult to measure or find evidence for. Propaganda is a pretty extreme example, comparative to a video game with no political message. Is gaming culture entire separate from other culture(s) - no. They have their cross-overs. But they also have their key differences. One being that games don't reflect actions to be taken in reality.

Internalized sexism is possible. Is it widespread? I doubt it. Similar to internalized homophobia. Is it related to whether or not Smite causes real-world sexism? I don't think it is, but you may disagree.

With regards to Deities:

Humans represent them in myths, lore and tales, but if they exist then they are independent of us. They are immortal and have magical power as you say, so they are fundamentally different from humans and not to be treated in the same way [they're pretty big differences.] This goes for your logic on armour, weapons and nudity. Deities and humans are fundamentally different, so if they were to exist I doubt our logic would apply to them. Treating them like humans is disrespectful, as they fundamentally aren't, even if they share traits theoretically.

Smite is a MOBA, not a SIM. So naturally characters will only ever be dressed in one way [except for skins.] They don't get changed in the middle of battle.

With regards to Sources:

You're making claims, the onus is on you to provide valid and neutral sources for your all of your claims, which you haven't done IMO. You've provided an invalid source for Rape culture and multiple invalid / bias sources for internalized sexism. Nothing on how sexualisation causes real-world sexism, neither in the context of video games or a wider context. But let me explain why these sources aren't to be trusted/used:

Wikipedia isn't a source to use generally due to edit wars. And citing feminist sites is problematic if you're trying to present facts rather than ideology. Protip: The best place to get E-journals from Academics is websites like JSTOR, Dawnsonera and the University of Cambridge/Oxford Press websites. They tend to be of a high quality, although that doesn't mean they're perfect or unbias either. But it's a much better place to start.

With regards to Artistic justification and lore

I agree that they need to be consistent - male Gods should be presented in lore terms just like female ones are. But we must also reserve the right of Hi-rez to take artistic liberties, as is their right as part of a liberal society. Do I think it's unfair that male Gods are generally more diverse atm? Yes. I hope they find new female Gods that they can present in more unique ways, for the sake of keeping things fresh and fair. But do I think this is an immense issue? Not at all. I think naturally, as the roster increases, we'll get more quirky male and female deities.

With regards to beauty and sexualization:

They are both subjective. What is sexual to one could be beautiful to another. Or it could even be unappealing. They aren't arbitrary or objective, it's entirely open to interpretation. This is also in the context of deities - who are frequently sexualised anyway. They're already at an extreme to us, as they were discussed in a time way before our own, before concepts of things like equality existed. They're also from entirely different cultures, which is pretty important.

Conclusion:

Sexism is bad [Obviously.] But you've provided no proof, let alone valid evidence, that Sexualized pixels in video games are linked to real-world sexism. Some things you've said I feel are warranted - such as the fact that male and female deities in smite have been treated differently in terms of art direction. But overall unless you have compelling evidence to prove why this causes real-world sexism, and isn't simply an unfortunate fact, alot of what you said would be unjustified.

Remarkable (9)
Posts: 166

Dissecting Smite #1: Oversexualization, Stereotyping, Double-Standards, and Other Misogyny in Smite

Thread Locked

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

SmiteFire & Smite

Smite 2 Gods

Smite 1 Gods